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 Want To Ask: Assault Squad without Jump Packs

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seth.frostheart

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PostSubject: Want To Ask: Assault Squad without Jump Packs   Thu Apr 26, 2012 1:21 pm

15 years out of the hobby, inb4 TL;DR... please bear with my noobie questions guys Smile

Breaking open my recently purchased BA Battleforce, I noticed a 10 man Tactical Squad staring back at me. Don't get me wrong, I do like the bread-and-butter Tacticals but based on what I read and understand so far that it seems the current troop choice for BA players nowadays is almost always Assault Marines. So here's some of my questions:

Why bother with Tacticals(with or w/o a dedicated Rhino transport) if I can take Asssaults w/o Jump Packs(with or w/o a dedicated Rhino transport)? They seem to have the same general stats based on the codex. Correct me if I am wrong but I guess Tacticals are useful in Objective Holding (OH) games where they have access to OH useful all-range(long, medium and short range) loadouts like ML, Melta and Flamer combos.

Assaults cannot use ML for that long range counter in OH and they only have access to short-medium loadouts like the Melta and Flamer right? I reckon Assault's most common loadout of a bolt pistol and chainsword will be pretty crappy for OH if your opponents brings out some long range guns to pepper your guys that are camping on the objective...

Thank you for reading and inputs guys, really appreciate it Very Happy

But I guess with all these technicalities, it all boils down to the game type and terrain layout of the play area...

So, long story short, based off what I read online:
a) Blood Angels Assault squads can have Jump Packs and no dedicated transport.
b) Blood Angels Assault squads can remove their Jump Packs and still have no dedicated transport(question: -35pts, but pts are burned ie cannot use it to purchase other items/units?)
or
c) Blood Angels Assault squads can remove their Jump Packs and buy a reduced price dedicated transport(question: -35pts, but pts are burned ie cannot use it to purchase other items/units?)
d) Best squad type to take really depends on game type and terrain layout of the play area.

That and at the end of the day I think I just prefer the uniformity of yellow helmets for my troop choice in my fledgling BA army Laughing but I might just have that 1 squad of Tacticals to zip around in a Rhino for OH, if I do find time to play...
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Akshay A.

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PostSubject: Re: Want To Ask: Assault Squad without Jump Packs   Thu Apr 26, 2012 1:40 pm

Yes your right assault marines cannot have a transport because there fast attack units. there jump packs are kind of their transport, they can changeout their bolt gun for a plasma pistol. their sergeants have either a storm shield or a power fist. I believe that they can remove their jump packs because the same rule applies for the death company squads. but then you will have to change the weapon load out I think?

might be wrong but this is what iv'e heard from other BA players. I play space marines so i do know about assault marines.

hoped this helped you in any way Smile
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dann.toh
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PostSubject: Re: Want To Ask: Assault Squad without Jump Packs   Thu Apr 26, 2012 1:48 pm

not sure what your question is Very Happy
but anyway, just to correct you: BA Assault Marines can take off all their jump packs, and BUY a dedicated transport for a 35pts reduction. That's basically every transport except a Stormraven.

BA Tactical squads are not as versatile as Assault squads, and only really have access to one long range firepower. That being said, they are more likely to be combat-squaded (10 man becoming 2 units of 5). And they are ever so slightly cheaper Very Happy
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seth.frostheart

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PostSubject: Re: Want To Ask: Assault Squad without Jump Packs   Thu Apr 26, 2012 2:23 pm

Haha sorry... TL;DR disease. I tend to ramble... Anyways let me start over...

@dann:

Yeah I read that BA Assaults can remove their Jump Packs and get a dedicated Rhino -35 pts. The question is, can I use the -35 pts for units or gears, or is that considered burned points ie. in a X pts game, will I have an extra 35 pts to use if I take a 10x BA Assault without Jump Pack+Rhino instead of a 10x BA Assault with Jump Packs?

So in essence you reckon I should stick to a 10-man w/o Jump Pack Assault (mid-short range Melta/Flamer) over the 10-man Tactical (that has a long range ML)? Yeah I am thinking about the slight complications in losing that ML and Bolters. haha. Just thinking about the pain of getting mauled by long range attacks in Objective Camping games Very Happy

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dann.toh
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PostSubject: Re: Want To Ask: Assault Squad without Jump Packs   Thu Apr 26, 2012 2:33 pm

the 35pts reduction is specific to dedicated transports, so if you decide not to buy a dedicated transport, then it's wasted.

In terms of tactics, I've always favoured Jump pack units for BA - my whole BA army is jump infantry except for 3 vehicles.
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seth.frostheart

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PostSubject: Re: Want To Ask: Assault Squad without Jump Packs   Thu Apr 26, 2012 2:43 pm

even for open ground Objective Camping games? Just wondering how well does your troops do against long range shooty armies in such scenarios?
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Alvin K
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PostSubject: Re: Want To Ask: Assault Squad without Jump Packs   Thu Apr 26, 2012 2:48 pm

I usually see people take Assault Squads over Tactical Squads. But for me, I would play at least 1 Tactical Squad in my normal Blood Angel's list. Just because they're a good anchor unit that will really stick around for a long time. You don't usually see your Assault Squad last until the end of the game. And the best part is, free Flamer and Missile Launcher when you take the Tactical Squad.

Lots of players laugh at the Flamer, but I laugh at the sound of their burning bodies... Twisted Evil

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seth.frostheart

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PostSubject: Re: Want To Ask: Assault Squad without Jump Packs   Thu Apr 26, 2012 2:57 pm

Yeah Alvin I have the same idea. I reckon in any BA army there should be at least 1 Tactical Squad or more depending on game points, with the classic ML+Flamer combo Smile I'll pass all the Meltas to the Assaults though. I reckon they do better in their hands...

I don't play much but I love tacticstheorycrafting Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: Want To Ask: Assault Squad without Jump Packs   Thu Apr 26, 2012 11:40 pm

Tactical Marines vs Assault Marines
it all comes down to your army tactic and the roles you assigned for each unit..
I agree that on paper, it appeared that the Assault version trumps its counterpart..
and most of the 'enthusiastic' gamers I know uses a 5-man squad with discounted rhino and a meltagun as their Assault Squad configuration (since it's one of the cheap ways to get a vehicle with meltagun)..
but when played right, Tacticals trumps the Assaults most of the time..


However (from my simple point of view)..
just play with whatever unit you want and be comfortable with it..
theory, no matter how awesome it might be, is just theory..
effectiveness is proven in gameplay..
you can have a super army, but generalship wins you the game..
and the game is played by two players, where both want to have fun..
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PostSubject: Re: Want To Ask: Assault Squad without Jump Packs   Fri Apr 27, 2012 12:35 pm

I want Assault Squad as troops for my Raven Guard. Tacticals are okay, but they dont suit my Chapter Tactics.

So for me.. Assault Squad win.
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